Ben Ferguson: “The fact we don't know, as you just mentioned, tells you how…”

“How big do you think their fleet is? I mean, 50 ships, 60 ships would be my guess. It is somewhere between 2,000 vessels and 16,000 vessels. And they engage, by the way, The fact we don't know, as you just mentioned, tells you how big the fleet is. It is a massive number. It's engaged in theft, but it's illegal fishing at a scale that constitutes ecocide combined with gross human rights violations.” (01:51–01:55)

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